Dirtiest Trials of the Twentieth Century
1205
1 M O R N I N G S E S S I O N
2
3
4 (Whereupon, the following takes place in the
5 absence of the jury.)
6 THE COURT: Are all the lawyers here? Are all
7 the defendants here?
8 MR. TRABULUS: Yes, here is Mr. Geduldig.
9 Mr. Reffsin just went to the bathroom -- I said Reffsin.
10 I meant Wallenstein.
11 THE COURT: So Mr. Reffsin is not here?
12 MR. DUNN: Mr. Reffsin is here, I saw him.
13 MR. NEVILLE: I saw him, your Honor.
14 THE COURT: Where is he?
15 MR. NEVILLE: He might be in the men's room.
16 THE CLERK: He said his attorney is in the men's
17 room.
18 THE COURT: All right, have a seat.
19 (Whereupon, at this time there was a pause in the
20 proceedings.)
21 THE COURT: Where is your client,
22 Mr. Wallenstein?
23 MR. WALLENSTEIN: Judge. He is here. I presume
24 that he is in the men's room. I did see him about five
25 minutes ago.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1208
1 (Whereupon, at this time there was a pause in the
2 proceedings.)
3 THE COURT: Now that everyone is here, my
4 courtroom deputy received a phone call from alternate
5 juror number one, who said that his son was ill, had 104
6 temperature,
and he was taking him to the hospital, and
7 that he will be with him in the hospital. So he asked to
8 be excused.
9 Any objection?
10 MR. DUNN: Your Honor, I didn't hear which
11 juror.
12 THE COURT: Alternate juror number one.
13 Any objection?
14 MR. DUNN: No, your Honor.
15 MR. TRABULUS: No.
16 THE COURT: All right. He is excused.
17 MR. TRABULUS: Your Honor, if I may, before the
18 jury comes in, Mr. White informed me this morning a
19 witness he was not previously going to call, was going to
20 be called today, Mr. Ackerman, and he is going to be
21 testifying immediately after the present witness. Since I
22 had not really prepared a cross-examination in detail for
23 this witness, I will ask that we have a break after his
24 direct testimony.
25 THE COURT: Very well. Just remind me.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1209
1 MR. TRABULUS: Thank you.
2 MR. WHITE: Your Honor, to make it clear, the
3 reason I had to do that, after we broke last week, I spoke
4 to Mr. Ackerman, an attorney, and I anticipated he would
5 be testifying tomorrow. His calendar is filled with court
6 appearances and other meetings, and I had to rejuggle the
7 order of witnesses.
8
9 S U Z A N N E K O N O P K A - C H O A T E ,
10 called as a witness, having been previously
11 duly sworn, was examined and testified as
12 follows:
13
14 THE COURT: Were you questioning the witness,
15 Mr. Trabulus?
16 MR. TRABULUS: I think I indicated no further
17 questions, your Honor, and I am going to rest on that.
18 THE COURT: All right.
19 MR. JENKS: I will ask a few questions, your
20 Honor.
21 THE CLERK: Jury entering.
22 (Whereupon, the jury at this time entered the
23 courtroom.)
24 THE COURT: Good morning, members of the jury.
25 Please be seated.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1210
1 I see that alternate juror now number 4 finally
2 made it. Unfortunately, alternate juror number one's son
3 was very ill and had to be taken to the hospital. That's
4 why he was excused.
5 I want to thank you again for your punctuality,
6 sense of responsibility, dedication. It is certainly
7 appreciated.
8 Thanks very much.
9 Let's proceed with the cross-examination of the
10 witness Suzanne Konopka-Choate.
11 You are still under oath. You understand that?
12 THE WITNESS: Yes.
13 THE COURT: You may proceed, Mr. Jenks.
14 MR. JENKS: Thank you, your Honor.
15
16 CROSS-EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. JENKS:
18 Q
Good morning.
19 A Good morning.
20 Q You recall Mr. Trabulus asking you questions last
21 week, ma'am, about Tribute Magazine?
22 A Yes, I do.
23 Q And I think you said you joined the company Who's Who
24 Worldwide in the fall of 1993; is that correct?
25 A That's correct.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1211
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 Q What is your educational background?
2 A I have a bachelors degree in English from Stony Brook
3 University. I have an associates degree in early child
4 education.
5 THE COURT: I don't know if that microphone is
6 on. Do you want to tap it?
7 All right, it is on, okay.
8 Q And when you joined Who's Who Worldwide, you joined
9 in the public relations department; is that right?
10 A That's correct.
11 Q And your primary function, as I understand it, was to
12 produce a magazine for the members; am I correct?
13 A That's correct.
14 Q And that magazine, would it be fair to say was a
15 benefit one would get while being a member of Who's Who?
16 A That's correct.
17 Q Now, where did you physically work?
18 A At their Lake Success office.
19 Q 1983 Marcus Avenue?
20 A Yes.
21 Q Did you at any time work at the Sterling Who's Who
22 offices at 750 Lexington Avenue?
23 A Yes, we would go in collectively, the editorial
24 staff, periodically.
25 THE COURT: Excuse me one moment.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1212
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 (Whereupon, at this time there was a pause in the
2 proceedings.)
3 THE COURT: You may proceed.
4 Q Now, when you joined, was there a public relations
5 department already in place?
6 A Yes, there was.
7 Q And who ran the public relations department?
8 A Debra Benjamin.
9 Q And what functions did -- first of all, who is Debra
10 Benjamin?
11 A She was the executive editor of the magazine. She
12 was our boss, all of the magazine staff.
13 Q So, she was in charge, essentially, the way I
14 understand it, of the public relations departments?
15 A That's correct.
16 Q And your role in the public relations department was
17 what?
18 A Senior editor of Tribute.
19 Q All right.
20 When you had gone to work at Who's Who Worldwide
21 at 1983 Marcus Avenue, was Tribute Magazine already being
22 published, or were you involved in the first issue?
23 A It was already being published.
24 Q With respect to the magazines that Mr. Trabulus had
25 shown you, when was it that you had got there?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1213
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 A The second issue.
2 Q Okay.
3 Would it be fair to say that a Tribute Magazine
4 was a benefit that members received for being a part of
5 the Who's Who directories?
6 A Yes, that's correct.
7 Q They were not charged for the magazine, am I correct?
8 A Not to my knowledge, no.
9 We had discussed at one point like a yearly
10 subscription fee. I don't know if that ever happened
11 though.
12 Q You are not aware -- as far as you know members were
13 not charged to receive Tribute Magazine, right?
14 A That's correct.
15 Q And it was the goal of the company to give four of
16 these magazines per year annually?
17 A That's correct.
18 Q Now, would it be fair to say that based on your
19 testimony Friday, many influential people around the world
20 were interviewed
for the magazine?
21 A That's correct.
22 Q Did every member get the magazine, ma'am?
23 A Yes, they did.
24 Q So, whether you were a one year member or a five year
25 member or a lifetime member of Who's Who, you would
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1214
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 receive that magazine in the mail; is that correct?
2 A Yes.
3 Q As someone with experience in public relations, would
4 it be fair to say that that magazine had networking
5 benefits to members who would receive it?
6 A Yes, it did.
7 Q And in what respect would you say it had networking
8 benefits?
9 A Well, the articles that were contributed by Who's Who
10 members, they were of a benefit because they were on
11 subjects such as venture capital, or doing business in, I
12 don't know, other countries. I don't recall all the
13 articles but they were of a benefit, and that's why they
14 were written by the members to benefit other members.
15 Q There were various services provided by Who's Who
16 Worldwide that were promoted within Tribute Magazine; am I
17 correct?
18 A Yes.
19 Q Mr. Trabulus went through those with you, such as the
20 Med Jet, auto insurance, and health insurance and
21 discounted credit card; is that right?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And now, you testified about the CD-ROM that was at
24 Who's Who Worldwide; do you recall that?
25 A Uh-huh.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1215
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 Q Tell me, what is a CD-ROM?
2 A It's a CD with a complete -- this particular CD had a
3 complete listing of our membership, sort of little
4 profiles, addresses, type of business, favorite vacation
5 place, a variety of information on each member.
6 Q Were there telephone numbers on the CD-ROM of
7 members?
8 A I don't recall.
9 Q Okay.
10 But it did have addresses and business titles?
11 A Yes.
12 Q And so forth, am I correct?
13 A Yes, it did.
14 Q By taking the CD-ROM and putting it into a computer,
15 would one member be able to contact another member?
16 A Yes. They would probably have to call information if
17 there was no phone number. But, yes, they would.
18 Q Would it be fair to say that the CD-ROM itself was a
19 valuable networking tool that a member could have access
20 to?
21 A I never used it as a networking tool, so I don't know
22 if I can say.
23 Q Well, let me ask you this: For instance, if you were
24 a member in a stockbrokerage business as a stockbroker,
25 would you be able to go through that CD-ROM and reach out
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1216
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 to other stockbrokers?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Would you be able to reach out to certain members
4 that have a significant position in business such as vice
5 president or president?
6 A Yes, you would.
7 THE COURT: I am going to have to interrupt.
8 There is very important business going on. They are
9 building a new courthouse in Central Islip, and I have to
10 select the carpeting right now, for the courtroom and the
11 chambers. Is that right, Ms. Kelly?
12 JUDGE'S SECRETARY: That's right.
13 THE COURT: It will not take me long.
14 JUDGE'S SECRETARY: Two seconds. I like that
15 color.
16 (Whereupon, at this time there was a pause in the
17 proceedings.)
18 THE COURT: Sorry, it took longer than I thought
19 to select a carpeting for the courtroom and the chambers.
20 It took about two minutes to do it. It breaks my record,
21 normally it takes 30 seconds for me.
22 You may proceed.
23 MR. JENKS: Your Honor, may I publish these to
24 the jury? They are already in evidence, while I
25 question.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1217
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 THE COURT: Yes.
2 (Whereupon, the exhibit/exhibits were published
3 to the jury.)
4 THE COURT: What exhibit numbers are those,
5 Mr. Jenks?
6 MR. JENKS: I will have to look at them, your
7 Honor.
8 For the record, they are
9 Defendant's Exhibits Gordon CA, Defendant's Exhibit Gordon
10 D, Defendant's Exhibit Gordon G, and
11 Defendant's Exhibit Gordon C.
12 THE COURT: Very well.
13 I think they may have seen them on Thursday, but
14 that's all right.
15 Q You testified there were two networking parties, one
16 in the summer of 1994 and one in the fall of 1994; as a
17 result?
18 A I testified I wasn't sure of the dates, but there
19 were two parties.
20 Q Those are ballpark dates when those parties took
21 place?
22 A I don't think I testified to that. I wasn't sure of
23 the dates.
24 Q But they were in 1994?
25 A I can't even be sure of that.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1218
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 Q You don't know?
2 A Right.
3 Q You were at both of them; is that correct?
4 A Yes.
5 Q Were other members, or members of Who's Who Worldwide
6 in attendance at both of those parties?
7 A Yes.
8 Q Were they socializing at those parties?
9 A Yes, they were.
10 Q Who had planned or made arrangements for the
11 networking party?
12 A Myself, Debra Benjamin, Maggie Swendseid and Tracey
13 Colletti, at least one of them. And Tracey had left the
14 company. And she was replaced by a person by the name of
15 Linda, and I don't know her last name.
16 Q Both of those parties were held in the penthouse
17 apartment on 54th Street; is that right?
18 A That's correct.
19 Q And when you came to work at Who's Who Worldwide, you
20 said you came approximately in the fall of 1993, right?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And you strictly stayed in the public relations
23 department; am I correct?
24 A That is correct.
25 Q And you testified about the inclusion of nomination
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1219
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 ballots inside one of the editions of Tribute Magazine?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Whose idea was it to include the nomination ballots
4 inside Tribute Magazine?
5 A I am sure Bruce's.
6 Q It was Bruce's idea?
7 A Uh-huh.
8 Q Is it true that having a nomination ballot included
9 inside Tribute Magazine, so when members received the
10 magazines they would be able to recommend and infer other
11 members for membership?
12 A Yes.
13 Q And do you know how many people responded by sending
14 back the nomination ballots?
15 A I don't know.
16 Q You have no way of knowing, correct?
17 A Correct.
18 Q Did Bruce Gordon develop the nomination ballots that
19 went inside the Tribute Magazine?
20 A He may have given us guidelines, but actually Gary
21 Kohlar and I gave us settings on that.
22 THE COURT: How do you spell Kohlar?
23 THE WITNESS: K O H L A R.
24 Q Gary Kohlar was someone who worked in the public
25 relations department; am I correct?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1220
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 A No, he was the computer person.
2 Q Inside Who's Who Worldwide?
3 A That's correct.
4 Q How many people worked at the 1983 Marcus Avenue
5 Who's Who Worldwide offices while you were there from the
6 fall of 1993 up until the time that the government raided?
7 A Maybe a hundred or less.
8 Q A hundred or less?
9 A Yeah.
10 Q And when you present -- by the way, withdrawn.
11 Prior, subsequent to your testimony on Thursday
12 of last week, did you talk to anyone in the government
13 about your testimony in-between Thursday night and today?
14 A Yes, I did.
15 Q You did? And who was that?
16 A Ceci.
17 Q What was it that you and Ceci spoke about concerning
18 your testimony coming back here
on Monday?
19 A She asked me question she would potentially ask me
20 and I answered them.
21 Q Did she suggest to you anything you should say to
22 this jury?
23 A No, she did not.
24 Q Did you suggest anything you should say to the jury?
25 A I answered the questions as I will answer them today
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1221
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 if I am asked.
2 Q Okay.
3 Were you present, ma'am, the day that the
4 government came and arrested --
5 A Yes, I was.
6 Q -- various employees?
7 THE COURT: Excuse me. You have to wait until
8 the question is over, and then let there be a slight pause
9 before the answer. You are answering right on top of the
10 question. It makes it difficult for us to hear it and the
11 reporter to record it, so let there be a little pause.
12 Q You were present when the government had arrested
13 various individuals from Who's Who Worldwide?
14 A Yes, I was.
15 Q Where were you present, in which office?
16 A In my office.
17 Q Was it Who's Who Worldwide or Sterling Who's Who?
18 A Who's Who Worldwide.
19 Q And was that at 750 -- it was at 1983 Marcus Avenue;
20 is that correct?
21 A That's it, correct.
22 Q And the government came in and they put a lot of
23 people under arrest; is that correct?
24 A Yes.
25 Q Were you frightened when the government came?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1222
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 A Of course.
2 Q All right.
3 Could you tell us, how did the agents behave when
4 they came to 1983 Marcus Avenue to arrest the employees?
5 A I was in my office and an agent came to the door and
6 said step away from your computer. And I really -- I
7 wasn't allowed out of the office until I was allowed to go
8 home.
9 Q And how long would you say you were there?
10 A About two hours.
11 Q In other words, you weren't free to leave; am I
12 correct?
13 A No, I wasn't free to leave.
14 Q You were not placed under arrest, am I correct?
15 A That's correct.
16 Q Were there employees taken out of the offices in
17 handcuffs by the agents?
18 A I assume they were, but I did not see it.
19 Q Was anyone in the public relations department, to
20 your knowledge, arrested?
21 A No.
22 Q Now, there came a time subsequent to this raid that
23 you testified that you went back to work at Who's Who
24 Worldwide for free, am I correct?
25 A That's correct.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1223
Konopka
-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 Q And a lot of employees went back to work at Who's Who
2 Worldwide for free, correct?
3 A Less than ten.
4 Q And these were people that you had worked with
5 before, am I correct?
6 A Correct.
7 Q How long did you go back to Who's Who Worldwide and
8 work for free?
9 A Six to eight weeks. And I don't think I was always
10 working for free. I think Mr. Gordon paid me for two
11 weeks that I was there.
12 Q Out of the six or eight weeks?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And you worked a considerable period of time without
15 any money, correct?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And would it be fair to say that you worked there
18 without any money, because you believed in what you were
19 doing at Who's Who Worldwide?
20 A Absolutely.
21 Q You felt, am I correct, that this was a legitimate
22 organization that gainfully employed some 100 people and
23 it was wrongfully put out of business, am I correct?
24 A I felt that from my -- from the knowledge that I
25 could have, we did things the way they were supposed to be
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1224
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 done.
2 Q Okay.
3 A At that point, yes, I felt very strongly that it was
4 a good company, wrongfully charged, etcetera.
5 Q When you were working there, Mr. Gordon was the
6 president and CEO of Who's Who Worldwide, correct?
7 A That's correct.
8 Q And he was also the president and CEO of Sterling
9 Who's Who, correct?
10 A Yes.
11 Q Now, he wasn't running around from the fall of 1993
12 up until the time of the raid and thereafter with the
13 corporate purpose that members should be defrauded, was
14 he?
15 A No.
16 Q In other words, the purpose of producing Tribute
17 Magazine was to give a legitimate benefit and a book for
18 the members to use; is that correct?
19 A That's correct.
20 Q Mr. Gordon wasn't running around saying this is a
21 scam and this whole company is designed, and we intend to
22 defraud our members, was he?
23 A No.
24 Q You didn't hear people walking around in Who's Who
25 Worldwide while you were employed there saying our sole
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1225
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 purpose here is to defraud our members who are in this
2 directory, correct?
3 A No.
4 Q And would it be fair to say that Mr. Gordon believed
5 in the directories and the membership volumes he was
6 putting out?
7 A I would guess so, yes.
8 Q Yes.
9 Tell me why you went back for free to work there
10 for a number of weeks after the raid?
11 A I am not really sure. I was very attached to the
12 magazine. I had partially created it through its
13 evolution. And I did feel at the time that the government
14 had made a mistake.
15 Q Would it be fair to say that you felt that the
16 government had overreached?
17 A Yeah.
18 Q And that the government put this corporation and this
19 business and all these people out of work. Am I correct?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And these people needed jobs who worked there,
22 including yourself?
23 A That's correct.
24 Q Now, you know the company after the raid never really
25 got off the ground again, right?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1226
Konopka-Choate-cross/Jenks
1 A That's correct.
2 Q And you know all those people lost their jobs, right?
3 A Yes,
I do.
4 Q You know the people at Sterling Who's Who who were
5 working in Manhattan had lost their jobs as well; is that
6 right?
7 A That's correct.
8 Q They lost their job because the United States
9 government went in there and raided those companies,
10 correct, closed them down?
11 A That's true. They did close them down. But I can't
12 say that today that I believe it is the government's
13 fault.
14 Q Well, you don't know enough about it though, do you?
15 A No, I don't.
16 MR. JENKS: I have nothing further, Judge.
17
18 CROSS-EXAMINATION
19 BY MR. SCHOER:
20 Q Good morning Ms. Choate.
21 A Good morning.
22 Q Choate, right? Konopka-Choate?
23 A Whatever.
24 Q All right.
25 You indicated on direct examination that
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1227
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Mr. Gordon frowned upon people in different departments
2 socializing with each other; is that correct?
3 A That's correct.
4 Q And it was more than that, isn't that a fact, he
5 didn't want people in different departments to know what
6 other people were doing; is that correct?
7 A Yes.
8 Q The business was very departmentalized; is that fair
9 to say?
10 A Absolutely. Yes, it is.
11 Q All right.
12 Just so we understand, there was the department
13 that you were in; is that correct?
14 A Yes.
15 Q And I think you called that public relations; is that
16 correct?
17 A Public relations or editorial.
18 Q And at times it was called public affairs office,
19 isn't that so?
20 A I couldn't say.
21 Q Well, your boss was Debra Benjamin; is that correct?
22 A That's correct.
23 Q Do
you know what her title was?
24 A No, I don't. She was for the magazine executive
25 editor. If she had a different title beyond that I am not
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1228
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 completely aware of it, no.
2 Q Well, let me show you just to refresh your
3 recollection --
4 MR. SCHOER: May I, Judge?
5 THE COURT: Yes.
6 (Counsel approaches the witness stand.)
7 Q The masthead of the Tribute, I am not aware which
8 exhibit this is, but does that refresh your recollection
9 that she had another title as well?
10 A It says in the masthead, director of membership.
11 Q So, Debra Benjamin was in charge of all the
12 membership; is that correct?
13 A I don't know what her responsibilities were in
14 response to that.
15 Q Other than the Tribute Magazine, did she have any
16 other responsibilities that you are aware of?
17 A She in a large part controlled the mailings that we
18 used, the mail lists.
19 Q And when you say she controlled the lists --
20 A Contracted with list brokers --
21 Q Made sure the lists -- mailings went out?
22 A Yes.
23 Q Did she do statistics with respect to the mailings
24 and responses?
25 A Probably.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1229
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q Did she review the solicitation letters?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Did she change those solicitation letters?
4 A I would not know if she did.
5 Q So, she was really in charge of the whole area of
6 business that took care of mailings; is that correct?
7 A That's correct.
8 Q And when the agents came and made arrests, they
9 charged people with mail fraud; is that right?
10 A Yes.
11 Q Did they arrest Debra Benjamin?
12 A No, they did not.
13 Q Now, in addition to -- well, at times was your
14 department also called the communications department?
15 A Probably.
16 Q In fact, in Tribute, when it said to contact you, it
17 said to contact communications department for press
18 releases?
19 A We didn't tell people to contact us for press
20 releases. They were sort of filtered through the sales
21 department. If we were called communications in that
22 respect, I am not aware of it.
23 Q Were you called the communication departments with
24 respect to the Hilton Head?
25 A We may have been, yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1230
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q All right.
2 Now, you talked about your department, headed by
3 Debra Benjamin, in charge of membership; is that correct?
4 As well as Tribute and public relations; is that correct?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And there were other departments at Who's Who
7 Worldwide; isn't that correct?
8 A That is correct.
9 Q Can you tell us what the other departments were?
10 A There was a sales department and an administrative
11 department.
12 Q Who is the head of the administrative department?
13 A Liz Sautter, S A U T T E R.
14 Q What did the administration department do, do you
15 know?
16 A Data entry, probably invoicing, anything that had to
17 do with billings, maybe accounts payable, accounts
18 receivable at some point, I don't know.
19 Q Do you know who opened the mail when it came?
20 A Liz or Bruce.
21 Q So, was there a rule at Who's Who Worldwide that no
22 one else was supposed to open the mail other than Liz or
23 Bruce?
24 A I don't know if it was a rule, but all the mail I
25 received was unopened -- opened, excuse me.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q Previously opened by Liz or Bruce; is that correct?
2 A Yes, that's correct.
3 Q And would you say that Liz was Mr. Gordon's
4 right-hand man?
5 A Yes, I would.
6 Q And at the time that they came and did the raid was
7 Liz Sautter arrested?
8 A No.
9 Q And she was the person in charge of all the
10 invoicing; isn't that correct?
11 A Yes.
12 Q And the invoicing went out in the mail; isn't that
13 right?
14 A That's correct.
15 Q And she was in charge of mailing the directories; is
16 that right?
17 A I don't know who was responsible for that.
18 Q In any event, she collected all the mail that came in
19 and opened it?
20 A Yes.
21 Q Then you say there was a sales department; is that
22 correct?
23 A That's correct.
24 Q Did the sales department have anything to do with the
25 actual mailings of letters of solicitation?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1232
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A No, they didn't.
2 Q Did they have anything to do with the mailing of
3 Tribute?
4 A No.
5 Q Did they have anything to do with mailing invoices?
6 A No.
7 Q Did they have anything to do with opening the mail?
8 A Not to my knowledge, no.
9 Q Now, there were certain people at Who's Who who had
10 company cars; isn't that correct?
11 A That's correct.
12 Q And do you know who the people were who had company
13 cars?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Who is that?
16 A Liz Sautter, Debra Benjamin, Bruce Gordon.
17 Q So, Debra Benjamin had a car, and she was not
18 arrested, right?
19 A Right.
20 Q And Liz Sautter had a company car and she was not
21 arrested, right?
22 A Right.
23 Q And Mr. Gordon obviously had a company car and he was
24 arrested; isn't that so?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1233
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q And Mr. Gordon, I think you said on direct
2 examination, made decisions, the day to day decisions with
3 respect to Who's Who Worldwide; isn't that correct?
4 A Are that is correct.
5 Q And would you say that Mr. Gordon was a very hands on
6 CEO?
7 A Yes, he was.
8 Q And he made very, very -- withdrawn.
9 He made most of the decisions; isn't that
10 correct?
11 A That's correct.
12 Q As far as you know he made the decisions, or at
least
13 approved everything that went on at Who's Who Worldwide;
14 isn't that so?
15 A That's correct.
16 Q And at times Mr. Gordon became very upset; isn't that
17 so?
18 A Yes, it is.
19 Q He became upset with the sales department primarily;
20 isn't that so?
21 A I would say it was probably an equal distribution.
22 Q When you say equal distribution, equal among all the
23 different departments?
24 A Yes, in one fashion or another.
25 Q Okay.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 And at times did you see him get upset with the
2 salespeople because they had strayed from their
3 presentation?
4 A I don't know if I could say that.
5 Q When you did see Mr. Gordon get upset with any of the
6 people at Who's Who Worldwide, at times did he use foul
7 language?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And he got very, very mad; isn't that so?
10 A That is so.
11 Q Because he wanted things done his way; isn't that
12 right?
13 A Yes, correct.
14 Q Now, do you know Tara?
15 A Yes, I do.
16 Q And did you know Tara's last name?
17 A Garboski.
18 Q Did you know that was her last name while you were
19 working there at Who's Who?
20 A I think I did, yes.
21 Q At the office, though, she used a different name;
22 isn't that so?
23 A That is.
24 Q Do you know what that different name was?
25 A I believe it was Green.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1235
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q Okay.
2 Now, when you prepared the Tribute Magazine, you
3 listed various people on the masthead, what we call the
4 masthead, right? I am not familiar with that type of
5 language, but it is a masthead, right?
6 A Yes, it is.
7 Q Perhaps I can have you look at one if one of the
8 jurors --
9 (Magazine handed to the witness.)
10 Q Now, in the masthead, you listed Tara as Tara Green;
11 isn't that so?
12 A Yes.
13 Q You knew that was not her name, right?
14 A Yes.
15 Q And did you have any intent to deceive anyone by
16 listing her name as Tara Green on this masthead?
17 A No.
18 Q With respect to the Tribute in general, did you have
19 any intent to deceive anyone with respect to anything put
20 in this?
21 A No.
22 Q In any of the Tribute magazines?
23 A No.
24 Q You believed the things put in the Tribute magazines
25 to be true; isn't that so?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1236
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Yes.
2 Q And you believed you were providing a service for the
3 members; isn't that so?
4 A Yes.
5 Q Now, in this masthead you listed Tara Green, Tara
6 Garboski as a membership group director; is that right?
7 A Yes.
8 Q There were other membership group directors; isn't
9 that so?
10 A Yes.
11 Q Four or five, depending on the time period, isn't
12 that so?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And there were group directors at Who's Who Worldwide
15 and Sterling; isn't that so?
16 A Yes.
17 Q Part of Tara's job was to listen to the salespeople;
18 is that right?
19 A I was aware of that, yes.
20 Q And you were aware that she listened, that there was
21 some sort of recording -- withdrawn.
22 You were aware there was some means
23 electronically whereby she could listen to what the
24 salespeople were saying?
25
A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1237
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q And in addition, Mr. Gordon had the same ability;
2 isn't that correct?
3 A I believe so, yes.
4 Q Were you aware of the fact that Tara fired people
5 because they strayed from the presentation?
6 A I wouldn't have been aware of that, no.
7 Q Okay.
8 Were you aware of the fact that Mr. Gordon had
9 fired people because they strayed from the presentation?
10 A I wouldn't necessarily know that, unless maybe I
11 heard it.
12 Q Well, did you hear it?
13 A I couldn't really say.
14 Q Okay.
15 When members complain, what department did they
16 complain to?
17 A A few may have come across our desk. I can't really
18 say whether they did or didn't. The members we spoke to
19 really did not have complaints. They were happy members.
20 Q Okay.
21 Most of the members you spoke to were really
22 happy; is that right?
23 A Yes, most of them.
24 Q They believed they were getting something of value;
25 isn't that so?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Yes.
2 Q And they wrote letters saying they were happy with
3 the benefits being provided to them. Isn't that so?
4 A Yes.
5 Q How many letters would you get on say a monthly
6 basis?
7 A I couldn't tell you. I don't know.
8 Q More than 50?
9 A Honestly, I just don't know. I don't have a
10 recollection of the number. They wouldn't have
11 necessarily all have come to me. So I couldn't be able
12 to -- they would have come to -- I guess to the office and
13 then distributed.
14 Q Okay.
15 Some of those
letters ended up in the Tribute;
16 isn't that correct?
17 A Yes.
18 Q And in the Tribute people said things like I have
19 been a member for a couple of months now, and I am
20 delighted. I spoke highly of the organization to several
21 professionals or CEOs located in my city?
22 MR. LEE: Your Honor, excuse me. May I have a
23 clarification as to which exhibit Mr. Schoer is referring
24 to when he is reading this, please?
25 THE COURT: Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1239
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 MR. SCHOER: It is the exhibit that is in front
2 of her right now. This is my copy.
3 Q It is this one with the people on it?
4 A Yes.
5 Q Which is it?
6 A Gordon-C.
7 Q Gordon-C. Thank you.
8 In addition to the letters you received, you
9 spoke to a lot of members; is that correct?
10 A Yes.
11 Q And the members you spoke to were also happy with the
12 benefits they were receiving?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And they believed there was some value in being a
15 member of Who's Who Worldwide?
16 A Yes.
17 Q Now, these magazines, were you involved in the cost
18 and expense of preparing them?
19 A No, I am not specifically.
20 Q Do you have any idea what the cost of a magazine like
21 that would be to produce?
22 A I think we estimated at one point maybe $500,000 a
23 year, given salary and expenses.
24 Q That was a $500,000 benefit you were giving to
25 members without any cost; isn't that right?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1240
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Yes.
2 Q Now, in addition to giving those magazines to
3 members, the staff received copies of them; isn't
that
4 correct?
5 A Yes, they did.
6 Q And in particular the sales staff received copies of
7 those Tributes; isn't that so?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And the things in the Tribute, which you believed to
10 be true, the sales staff read about and they believed to
11 be true; isn't that so?
12 A Yes.
13 Q Now, you indicated on direct examination that there
14 were some press releases given to members which were free;
15 is that correct?
16 A I believe it was part of their package, membership
17 package.
18 Q All right.
19 Would that be something, similar to this type of
20 document?
21 (Handed to the witness.)
22 A Yes, it would be.
23 MR. SCHOER: Does the Court wish us to mark it
24 separately with respect to each defendant?
25 THE COURT: No. Each defendant would be marked
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL
COURT REPORTER
1241
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 consecutively as to each letter.
2 Do you have a sheet letting you know how I wish
3 the exhibits to be marked?
4 MR. SCHOER: No, your Honor.
5 (Sheets distributed.)
6 THE COURT: Those are the ways I wish the
7 letters -- the exhibits to be marked pursuant to the
8 alphabet.
9 MR. SCHOER: I will give it out to counsel.
10 I will offer Defendant's Exhibit I in evidence.
11 THE COURT: Any objection?
12 MR. WHITE: A brief voir dire, your Honor?
13 THE COURT: Yes. What is it?
14 MR. SCHOER: A sample press release.
15
16 VOIR DIRE EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. WHITE:
18 Q Ms. Konopka-Choate, have you seen this document
19 before?
20 A Yes. I have.
21 MR. WHITE: Then I have no objection, your
22 Honor.
23 THE COURT: Defendant's Exhibit I for Item, in
24 evidence.
25 (Defendant's Exhibit I received in evidence.)
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1242
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1
2 CROSS-EXAMINATION (cont'd)
3 BY MR. SCHOER:
4 Q Defendant's Exhibit I is an example of the free press
5 release sent with the packet when someone else became a
6 member; isn't that correct?
7 A I can't recall. I know we used them as an outline
8 for just a standard press release, a one time thing. And
9 that's the outline we used. I can't recall if we sent
10 them out.
11 Q I think you said something about receiving it in a
12 membership packet?
13 A No. As part of a membership -- as part of a
14 membership.
15 Q Okay.
16 A Depending on the level of membership and the level
17 purchased, they would receive some public relations type
18 purchase
--
19 Q In addition there were public relations services
20 which could be purchased; is that correct?
21 A Yes, there were.
22 Q I show you what is marked as Defendant's Exhibit J
23 for Identification, and ask you if you are familiar with
24 that document.
25 (Handed to the witness.)
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Yes, I am.
2 Q That's a list of the benefits that were available to
3 members; is that correct?
4 A Yes, it is.
5 Q And at some point that document was sent to members
6 with respect to their benefits; isn't that so?
7 A I didn't send it out, so I wouldn't know if it was
8 sent to them on a regular basis or anything.
9 Q On the second page there is a whole list of public
10 relations type services that were being offered; isn't
11 that correct?
12 A Yes.
13 Q And were you the -- were you one of the people
14 involved in providing those public relations services?
15 A Yes, I was.
16 MR. SCHOER: Your Honor, at this time I would
17 offer Defendant's Exhibit J.
18 MR. WHITE: Can I just look at it?
19 (Counsel confer.)
20 MR. WHITE: No objection from the government.
21 THE COURT: Defendant's Exhibit J for Jack, in
22 evidence.
23 (Defendant's Exhibit J received in evidence.)
24 Q We talked about some of the other benefits that
25 members had.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1244
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 In the Tribute Magazine, you listed those
2 benefits; isn't that correct?
3 A Yes.
4 Q And there was a benefit that we have not discussed
5 yet, one that was called the Who's Who Worldwide Executive
6 Club Gold Portfolio. Are you familiar with that?
7 A No, not specifically.
8 Q Okay.
9 That was the benefit where members would receive
10 preferred rates in a money market account and a
11 certificate of deposit?
12 A I am not familiar with that at all.
13 Q Okay.
14 Looking at the Tribute that is in front of you
15 with respect to the benefits, do you see that listed as
16 one of the benefits?
17 A You are talking about the MBNA?
18 Q No.
19 A What page is it? 37. There is a wheel, a ferris
20 wheel?
21 Q No -- yes.
22 A Okay.
23 Q The ferris wheel.
24 A I knew this to be just a credit card account. I
25 didn't know the specifics of it.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1245
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q Well, on page, looking at the same document that you
2 have in front of
you, on page 7, the third document, the
3 third column down, the third item down, I am sorry, it
4 talks about the Gold portfolio; is that correct?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And that's separate from the Gold Mastercard; is that
7 right?
8 A Listed separately, yes.
9 Q And talks about certificates of deposits and money
10 market at preferred rates; is that so?
11 A Yes, it does.
12 Q Further down in that column, there is a benefit
13 relating to people interested in doing business in Russia,
14 China or Thailand; isn't that correct?
15 A Yes.
16 Q And the contact with respect to the Russian business
17 was the Itar-Tass that you talked about?
18 A Yes.
19 Q And also, there was a contact in China called Hyde,
20 H Y D E, International; is that correct?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And there was also a Thailand Who's Who, which had
23 some affiliation with Who's Who Worldwide; isn't that
24 correct?
25 A That's what it says here, yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1246
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q And when these things were placed in the Tribute, you
2 believed them to be true; is that right?
3 A Yes.
4 Q And you believed that those were in fact benefits
5 provided to members?
6 A That's correct.
7 Q That they could take advantage of if they wanted to
8 take advantage of them; is that correct?
9 A Yes.
10 Q Is it fair to say that some members would take
11 advantage of some benefits, and other members would not
12 take advantage of the same benefits; isn't that so?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And you provided the benefits to all the members; is
15 that right?
16 A Yes, that's correct.
17 Q You talked yesterday about a survey in one of the
18 Tributes; is that correct; is that correct?
19 A Yes.
20 Q And that survey was attached to the Tribute, and you
21 asked people to return it; is that correct?
22 A Yes.
23 Q In fact, it is the same Tribute that you have in
24 front of you; is that right?
25 A I am looking.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1247
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q All right.
2 It is page 24:
3 A Yes.
4 Q And that survey, did you receive responses?
5 A Yes, we did.
6 Q Do you have any idea how many responses you received?
7 A I would say maybe about a thousand, maybe a little
8 more.
9 Q And the idea was to take those responses and to use
10 them to provide new benefits to members; is that so?
11 A Yes.
12 Q And to provide some direction with respect to the
13 Tribute Magazine?
14 A Yes, that's correct.
15 Q And if someone responded, it says on here that they
16 would receive a free gift; is that correct?
17 A That's correct, yes, it is.
18 Q Do you know what the gift was that they were to
19 receive?
20 A I think it may have been a leather -- something like
21 a little leather note pad.
22 Q And did people get that?
23 A Yes, they did.
24 Q And there was a whole series leather items that were
25 offered by Who's Who Worldwide; is that correct?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1248
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A That's correct.
2 Q And people purchased those; isn't that so?
3 A Yes, it is.
4 Q And there were other offers -- offers for people, a
5 car medallion to put on your car; is that right?
6 A Yes.
7 Q And members purchased those; is that right?
8 A Yes, I believe they did, but it was not a function of
9 ours.
10 Q Okay.
11 But members purchased those items because they
12 believed those items had some value to them; isn't that
13 so?
14 A I don't know why they would purchase them.
15 Q Okay.
16 MR. SCHOER: May I have a second, please, your
17 Honor?
18 THE COURT: Yes.
19 (Whereupon, at this time there was a pause in the
20 proceedings.)
21 Q Now, looking at that -- let's look at volume 2,
22 spring 1994.
23 A Okay.
24 Q Which is Exhibit --
25 A Gordon G.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1249
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q Gordon-G, thank you.
2 There is a message from Mr. Gordon, the CEO and
3 publisher; isn't that correct?
4 A Yes.
5 Q On page 2?
6 A Yes.
7 Q And at the bottom of that
message there is a P S;
8 isn't that right?
9 A Yes.
10 Q And can you read to the jury that P S.
11 A Our organization is growing rapidly both domestically
12 and internationally. Who's Who --
13 THE COURT: You have to slow down when you read.
14 Do you want to try it again, please?
15 THE WITNESS: Our organization is growing rapidly
16 both domestically and internationally. Who's Who
17 Executive Club reflects our globalizm with expanded
18 services and privileges.
19 Q Did you believe that to be true when you sent out
20 this Tribute Magazine to members?
21 A Yes.
22 Q You weren't trying to deceive any members with
23 respect to that, were you?
24 A No.
25 Q Okay.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1250
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 I am looking at page 7. There is a header
2 saying, Who's Who Executive Club business center opens its
3 doors, on the second column.
4 A Yes.
5 Q Can you tell us what that is about?
6 A That's about use of the Sterling offices for its
7 conference facilities or fax facilities, general business
8 facilities. There were a lot of conference rooms on those
9 premises.
10 Q And it talks about four private meetings,
11 accommodations from two to 15 people, food services,
12 catering; is that correct?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And did you believe that that service was being
15 provided to members?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And in fact was available to members?
18 A Yes.
19 Q In fact, you had been to the Lexington Avenue
20 location; is that correct?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And you saw those facilities; is that correct?
23 A Yes.
24 Q And you were not intending to fool anyone when you
25 put that in the Tribute Magazine that something in fact
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1251
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 available for members, were you?
2 A No.
3 Q Let's look at another one that you were looking at
4 before, Gordon-C.
5 A Thanks.
6 Q And I will ask you to look at page 22.
7 That's a member profile of a senior
8 correspondence for Hard Copy; is that correct?
9 A Yes.
10 Q And Hard Copy is one of those television
11 journalist -- journalism shows?
12 A Yes, it is.
13 Q It is called Hard Copy because they take on hard
14 things at times; is that right?
15 A Yes.
16 Q And she was a member of Who's Who Worldwide?
17 A Or Sterling.
18 Q Or Sterling.
19 You weren't trying to hide anything from Hard
20 Copy about the business of Who's Who Worldwide, were you?
21 A No.
22 Q You weren't trying to deceive that member or any
23 other member from the business of Who's Who Worldwide,
24 were you?
25 A No.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1252
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q And if you were trying to deceive someone, you
2 definitely would not go out of your way to find someone
3 from hard copy, would you?
4 A No.
5 Q Looking at page 31 of the same exhibit. There is an
6 advertisement there concerning the Tribute Magazine; is
7 that right?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And they are asking for people who are interested in
10 advertising in Tribute, to contact someone called the
11 Coppola, C O P P O L A, Group; is that correct?
12 A That is.
13 Q At the beginning Who's Who Worldwide was doing -- was
14 collecting its own advertisements; is that right?
1
5 A Yes, it is.
16 Q For the Tribute Magazine?
17 A Yes.
18 Q And after a while, this Coppola Group took over that
19 function; is that correct?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And this ad, did you have any part in preparing this
22 ad?
23 A Yes. I probably typeset it.
24 Q When you typeset this and it said which quarterly
25 magazine is read only by top business leaders, did you
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 believe that not to be true?
2 A No, I believed it was true.
3 Q And you weren't trying to deceive anyone when you put
4 that in the magazine, right?
5 A No.
6 Q By the way, the answer to that question is Tribute,
7 that's the quarterly magazine read only by top business
8 people, right?
9 A Yes.
10 Q Now, looking at page 43 of that, that's a section
11 called: Member Spotlights; is that correct?
12 A Yes, it is.
13 Q And some of those people that are spotlighted in
14 those member spotlights, are people who were not in
15 Fortune 500 companies; is that right?
16 A That's correct.
17 Q And they were people who were starting their own
18 businesses; is that right?
19 A Yes, it is.
20 Q They were presidents of their own businesses; is that
21 right?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And they provided services like design, graphic
24 design or restaurant services, right?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q And gifts?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Those kind of things that executives could purchase,
4 right?
5 A Yes.
6 Q You believed those members to be qualified members of
7 Who's Who?
8 A
I didn't determine qualification.
9 Q Did you ever interview -- did you interview the
10 people to put in the spotlight?
11 A No, some of them actually by -- Vi, V I, Harrington,
12 H A R R I N G T O N, she submitted practically an entire
13 portfolio and wanted very much to be profiled.
14 Q And of these people really wanted to be profiled
15 because they saw value in being profiled; is that right?
16 A Yes.
17 Q Vi Harrington was the director of the Culinary
18 Institute of Louisiana; is that right?
19 A Yes.
20 Q And she wanted to be profiled here because she felt
21 it would be good for her business; isn't that right?
22 A I couldn't tell you why.
23 Q Okay.
24 And other people who were in the spotlight.
25 Those were people who were interviewed?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1255
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A They either interviewed, were interviewed, excuse me,
2 or submitted portfolios from which we wrote the
3 spotlights.
4 Q And you believed that these spotlights were of
5 interest to members and perhaps would provide some sort of
6 networking basis for the people who were profiled; isn't
7 that correct?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And you believed in all of the profiles that you did,
10 that they would provide networking for the people who were
11 profiled; is that so?
12 A I don't know if that was the intention of the
13 profiles.
14 Q Not necessarily the intention, but a result of?
15 A It could possibly be a result of the profile, yes.
16 Q In fact, you received letters from people who were
17 profiled in prior magazines, where they said as a result
18 of the profile I received one call, two calls, four calls;
19 isn't that right?
20 A Yes, that's correct.
21 Q And they were happy about being profiled and then
22 receiving calls that related to their business; is that
23 so?
24 A Yes.
25 Q Would you now look at volume number five.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1256
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Gordon-D.
2 Q Yes, Gordon-D.
3 Looking at page 4, it is another ad from the
4 Coppola Group; is that correct?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And did you have any part in preparing that ad?
7 A None, other than maybe the placement of it, or the
8 choice of color that was used.
9 Q Where it says on the top, fact, Who's Who Executive
10 Club members are top CEOs, presidents, chairmen and CFOs
11 of major corporations.
12 Did you believe that to be true?
13 A I don't think I ever thought about it.
14 Q You weren't intending to deceive anyone when that was
15 placed in the Tribute Magazine, were you?
16 A No.
17 Q Now, there came a time you said you went to certain
18 cocktail parties; is that correct?
19 A Yes.
20 Q And there were two cocktail parties at the penthouse
21 for members?
22 A That's correct.
23 Q You were part of that group which chose which members
24 to invite?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q And you were also present at the cocktail parties?
2 A Yes, I was.
3 Q Was Tara Garboski present at any of the cocktail
4 parties?
5 A No, she was not.
6 Q At any time while you were working at Who's Who
7 Worldwide, did you have any idea about Mr. Gordon and his
8 finances?
9 A None.
10 Q Did you have any idea about the finances of the
11 companies?
12 A None.
13 Q There came a time when, when you were in court in May
14 of 1994; is that correct, with respect to a hearing in a
15 bankruptcy proceeding?
16 A No, I wasn't present.
17 Q You weren't present in the courtroom?
18 A No, I was not.
19 Q So, you didn't hear what other people had testified
20 to with respect to that that day?
21 A I don't think so, no.
22 Q Okay.
23 Were you involved in the preparation of any
24 affidavits that Ms. Benjamin may have signed?
25 A No, I wasn't.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q Or Ms. Swendseid?
2 A No.
3 Q She was in your department?
4 A The managing editor of Tribute.
5 Q You were not involved in the preparation of any
6 affidavit she may have signed?
7 A No.
8
Q Were you involved in the preparation of any
9 statistical analysis of the CD-ROM?
10 A No, I don't believe I was.
11 Q Could you have been?
12 A I believe it is possible, but I don't believe I had
13 anything to do with that.
14 Q Do you know whether there was any statistical
15 analysis done with respect to how many presidents, how
16 many vice presidents, how many CEOs were included on the
17 CD-ROM?
18 A I recall something, and probably Debra Benjamin would
19 have done that.
20 Q I am going to show you what I have marked as
21 Defendant's Exhibit K for Identification.
22 (Handed to the witness.)
23 Q Are you familiar with that document?
24 A I don't think so, no.
25 Q Let's look at this last Tribute Magazine, the one
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1259
Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 with the lady at the computer.
2 A Uh-huh.
3 Q What exhibit number is that?
4 A Gordon-F.
5 Q Thank you.
6 Looking at, I believe it is page 3.
7 (Whereupon, at this time there was a pause in the
8 proceedings.)
9 Q That's an ad for the CD-ROM?
10 A Yes, it is.
11 Q And did you have any involvement in the preparation
12 of that ad?
13 A No. We had an artist who was responsible for this
14 ad.
15 Q The ad indicates that the CD-ROM included 57,000 plus
16 membership roster of top decision makers; is that correct?
17 A Yes.
18 Q Did you believe that to be true?
19 A I don't know if I ever thought about it.
20 Q Well, when that was placed in the Tribute you didn't
21 intend to deceive anyone, did you?
22 A No.
23 Q That ad also indicates that the CD-ROM contains
24 information that is not available from any other
single
25 source. Did you believe that to be true?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Yes.
2 Q You didn't intend to deceive anyone when that was
3 placed in the Tribute Magazine, did you?
4 A No.
5 Q The ad also indicates that Who's Who Executive Club
6 is executive networking at its best. Do you see that?
7 A Uh-huh.
8 Q Did you believe that to be true?
9 A Again, I don't know that I ever thought about it.
10 Q But you didn't intend to deceive anyone with respect
11 to that statement, did you?
12 A No.
13 Q Looking at the ad several pages later concerning the
14 Hilton Head conference --
15 A Uh-huh.
16 Q -- that indicates that this is a golf or tennis
17 tournament, and you or members would be able to network
18 with other members; isn't that so?
19 A Yes.
20 Q And in fact, the weekend was called network tee and
21 tennis; is that right?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And did you believe that to be true, that members
24 would be able to network with other members if they went
25 on this trip?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Yes.
2 Q You didn't intend to deceive anyone with respect to
3 that when you placed that in the Tribute, did you?
4 A No.
5 Q Looking at the ad concerning the Advantage calling
6 card. Do you have that one?
7 A Uh-huh.
8 Q That ad indicates that Who's Who Executive Club group
9 strength help control a major office expense.
10 Do you see that?
11 A Yes.
12 Q Did you believe that to be true?
13 A Yes.
14 Q You weren't trying to deceive anyone with respect to
15
that, right?
16 A No.
17 Q On the next page there is an ad for Airborne
18 Express. And that ad indicates, using the buying power of
19 all our members, we have developed a program that delivers
20 significant savings.
21 Did you believe that to be true?
22 A Yes.
23 Q You weren't trying to fool or deceive anyone with
24 respect to that statement, were you?
25 A No.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q Now, go to page 33.
2 On page 33 there is a schedule of advertising
3 rates for the Tribute Magazine; isn't that correct?
4 A Uh-huh.
5 Q And that was before the Coppola Group was involved?
6 A I don't know when they became involved.
7 Q Okay.
8 But this doesn't mention the name "Coppola
9 Group?"
10 A Right.
11 Q And with respect to this ad, it indicates that you
12 were planning issues in the future; is that correct?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And as far as you were concerned, this company was
15 going to stay in business. You were going to provide the
16 Tribute as a membership benefit for many, many, many
17 years; isn't that right?
18 A Yes.
19 Q And you were planning to do that; isn't that right?
20 A Yes, that is.
21 Q And other people at Who's Who Worldwide?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And, in fact, you were taking ads for issues out into
24 1996; isn't that so?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q According to this, winter of 1996.
2 A That's correct.
3 Q And you were not intending to deceive anyone by
4 placing the ad in the Tribute Magazine; it was your intent
5 to prepare a Tribute to
the future; is that correct?
6 A Yes, it was.
7 Q And looking to the back page, it is an advertisement
8 for Cadillac?
9 A Yes.
10 Q It indicates in there that Cadillac is an oasis of
11 comfort and serenity?
12 A Yes.
13 Q That's advertisement, isn't it?
14 A Yes.
15 Q It is puffing, right?
16 A Yes.
17 Q You don't believe when you read this ad for Cadillac,
18 that Cadillac is really an oasis for comfort and serenity,
19 do you?
20 A No.
21 Q That is not what causes you to purchase a Cadillac,
22 is it?
23 A I should hope not.
24 Q Okay.
25 It is advertising, right?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 A Yes.
2 Q It is puffery, right? Okay.
3 (No response.)
4 Q Looking at one more ad, there is an ad for Who's Who
5 watches?
6 A In the same issue?
7 Q Yes. Opposite page 30, or page 30.
8 A Okay.
9 Q That ad indicates that these watches make a powerful
10 statement -- make a powerful statement with the Who's Who
11 Executive Club collection timepieces, right?
12 A Yes.
13 Q That's advertising, right?
14 A Yes.
15 Q It is puffery, right?
16 A Sure, yes.
17 Q You can't make a powerful statement by wearing a
18 watch, can you?
19 A No.
20 Q You didn't intend to deceive anyone when you put in
21 that advertising, did you?
22 A No.
23 Q You didn't intend to deceive members when you offered
24 this service; isn't that right?
25 A That's right.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 Q The ability to buy a watch, right?
2 A Right.
3 Q Then it goes on to say that each watch is not only
4 functional, but truly a work of art.
5 Did you believe that to be true?
6 A No, not necessarily.
7 Q Okay.
8 It is puffery, right?
9 A Yes.
10 Q It is advertising, right?
11 A Yes.
12 Q It is institutionalized lying? That's what
13 advertising is in a way, right?
14 A Sure.
15 Q Okay.
16 So, when someone reads this, they don't
17 necessarily believe that this watch is truly a work of
18 art, right?
19 A I hope not.
20 Q So, you don't intend to deceive anyone when you make
21 this kind of representation; isn't that so?
22 A That is correct.
23 MR. SCHOER: I have no further questions.
24 THE COURT: Anybody else?
25 MR. NELSON: May I inquire, Judge?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Schoer
1 THE COURT: Yes.
2
3 CROSS-EXAMINATION
4 BY MR. NELSON:
5 Q Good morning, Ms. Konopka-Choate.
6 A Good morning.
7 Q My name is Alan Nelson, I represent Frank Osman, I
8 believe you know him by the name of Frank Martin sitting
9 in the corner. Do you know Mr. Martin?
10 A Yes, I do.
11 Q I believe you testified that you became -- came to
12 become employed at Who's Who Worldwide in approximately
13 the fall of 1993; is that correct?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Now, when you came to work at Who's Who Worldwide, am
16 I correct that Mr. Martin was not working at Who's Who
17 Worldwide?
18 A That's correct.
19 Q And when you first came to work at Who's Who
20 Worldwide, am I correct that there was already one
21 addition of Tribute that had already been published and
22 released?
23 A Published, not released. It was in the blues, which
24 is a final proofing stage.
25 Q And that was eventually released and disseminated to
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 the various different members of the organization; is that
2 right?
3 A That's correct, uh-huh.
4 Q And you continued to work on the Tribute Magazine
5 until the company was closed down; is that correct?
6 A Yes.
7 Q In total there were five volumes of Who's Who
8 Worldwide, the Tribute Magazine which was published; is
9 that right?
10 A Yes.
11 Q And the second volume, the first one you worked on, I
12 would like you to turn your attention to that.
13 If you turn to page 2, there is a masthead there
14 listing the various different employees who are working at
15 the company?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And there is a listing there of people who would be
18 known as in the sales department, as membership group
19 leaders; is that correct?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And Mr. Martin is not listed in that section; is that
22 correct?
23 A Yes, that's correct.
24 Q Because he wasn't working at the company at that
25 point in time?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 A That's correct.
2 Q How many other group leaders are listed in that
3 edition?
4 A Six.
5 Q And I would like to turn your attention to the next
6 volume, and I believe that is volume three.
7 A Yes.
8 Q And in the second page of the masthead, is Mr. Martin
9 there listed as a group leader?
10 A No.
11 Q How many group leaders are listed there?
12 A Four.
13 Q I would like to turn your attention
now to the third
14 edition of Who's Who.
15 A Fourth.
16 Q Fourth edition, I apologize, of the Tribute Magazine.
17 Is Mr. Martin listed in that edition?
18 A No, he is not.
19 Q How many group managers were there in the fourth
20 edition of Tribute Magazine?
21 A Four -- five, excuse me, five.
22 Q Now, the Tribute Magazine in front of you, the fourth
23 edition, that would have been the fall 1994 edition; is
24 that correct?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 Q So as of the fall of 1994 there would have been four
2 separate editions of Tribute Magazine which had been
3 disseminated to the various different members of Who's Who
4 Worldwide; is that correct?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And Mr. Schoer and other counsel has gone over with
7 you the various different details of the contents of the
8 different Tribute magazines. I will not belabor that
9 month in any great detail at this point.
10 Do you recall when Mr. Martin first came to work
11 at Who's Who Worldwide while you are employed there?
12 A No, I am I don't recall.
13 Q I would like to turn your attention to the last
14 Tribute, the fifth edition. Was he listed in the masthead
15 in that edition?
16 A Yes, he is.
17 Q So, is it fair to say that he came to work at Who's
18 Who Worldwide sometime between the fall of 1994, and I
19 guess the winter of 1995; is that right?
20 A Yes.
21 Q Did each of the four Tribute magazines, the first
22 four Tribute magazines contain a page with a nomination
23 request that could be sent via members for other people to
24 become members of Who's Who Worldwide?
25 A I don't recall if they each did. I have seen it in
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1270
Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 two, so I will just look quickly.
2 I think just two.
3 Q Approximately how many copies of the Tribute Magazine
4 were disseminated with each edition?
5 A I think about 75,000.
6 Q And am I correct that the nomination ballots ask for
7 members, or give the members the benefit of nominating at
8 least two people?
9 A Yes, I do.
10 Q And as of the time that Mr. Martin came to work at
11 Who's Who Worldwide, there at least existed the ability
12 for anywhere in excess of 150,000 ballots for nominations
13 to come in from existing members; is that correct?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Now, as of the time that Mr. Martin came to work for
16 the company, I believe it was your testimony that you felt
17 that the Tribute Magazine was a publication which
18 accurately reflected the policies and memberships of Who's
19 Who Worldwide; is that correct?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And you truly believed in the contents of the
22 publication itself; is that correct?
23 A Yes.
24 Q And once Mr. Martin came to work for Who's Who
25 Worldwide did you have any discussions with him as to
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 whether or not he had read the publication that you had
2 prepared prior to his coming to the company?
3 A No, I don't think so.
4 Q You personally felt that the magazine accurately
5 reflected all the information relative to the company in
6 an accurate matter; is that right?
7 A Uh-huh.
8 THE COURT: Do you mean yes?
9 THE WITNESS: Yes.
10 Q If Mr. Martin had read the magazine prior to his
11 return, he would have had the benefit of seeing the
12 various different membership benefits set forth in
13 policies of the company; is that correct?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Are you aware of how many nomination ballots were
16 actually received from Who's Who Worldwide -- from members
17 by Who's Who Worldwide?
18 A I am not aware.
19 Q All right.
20 Could it be fair to say that part of the reason
21 why was as a result of the policy that was implemented by
22 Mr. Gordon prohibiting fraternization of members in the
23 different departments of the company?
24 A While that may be true, I think it had more to do
25 with the fact that it wasn't really within my job
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 responsibilities to know.
2 Q As a result of that policy did you not fraternize on
3 a regular basis with employees who worked in other
4 departments?
5 A I did not fraternize -- I personally did not
6 fraternize in the office. But I fraternized outside of
7 the office on my own time.
8 Q Did you find that other members -- other employees
9 likewise would abide by Mr. Gordon's policy of not
10 fraternizing with employees in other departments?
11 A Yes.
12 Q Would it be fair to say that as a result of this
13 policy you were unaware of what the duties and
14 responsibilities were of the different departments in the
15 company?
16 A I could speculate. But, yes, I was truly unaware of
17 what they were.
18 Q To the extent you did have any knowledge, it would be
19 based on Mr. Gordon advising you as to what the
20 responsibilities of each department was; is that correct?
21 A Yes, uh-huh.
22 Q So, would it be fair to say that the same would be so
23 as to members of other departments?
24 A Yes.
25 Q So, for example, for you to have an understanding as
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 to what was going on in sales, you would have to rely upon
2 Mr. Gordon's representations as to what was happening in
3 sales; is that correct?
4 A Absolutely.
5 Q Similarly the sales staff would have to rely on
6 Mr. Gordon's representations as to what the duties and
7 responsibilities of your department are; is that correct?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And the same would be true as it relates to the
10 administration department and the public relations
11 department; is that correct?
12 A Yes.
13 Q As a result of this policy, would it also be fair to
14 say that it would have been impossible for you to know
15 whether or
not the employees in that department were
16 performing the functions that Mr. Gordon claimed were
17 there responsibilities to perform?
18 A Yes, it would be impossible for me to know that.
19 Q I believe you indicated there were three individuals
20 in the company allowed access to all the departments,
21 Mr. Gordon, Ms. Sautter and Debra Benjamin; is that
22 correct?
23 A I don't believe I said access. And I think that
24 they, too, probably had limited involvement in the other
25 departments.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 Q So, the only person who would know specifically as to
2 one, whether or not -- what the specific responsibilities
3 were of each department; and, second, whether or not that
4 department was actually implementing those designated
5 responsibilities would have been Mr. Gordon; is that
6 right?
7 A That's correct.
8 MR. NELSON: Thank you.
9 THE COURT: Anyone else?
10 MR. LEE: Judge, it is 11:00 o'clock, do you want
11 me to continue?
12 THE COURT: We will take a ten-minute recess.
13 Please do not discuss the case. Keep an open
14 mind.
15 Please recess yourselves.
16 (Whereupon, at this time the jury leaves the
17 courtroom.)
18
19 (Whereupon, a recess is taken.)
20
21
22
23
24
25
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1275
Konopka-Choate-cross/Nelson
1 THE CLERK: Jury entering.
2 (Whereupon, the jury at this time entered the
3 courtroom.)
4 THE COURT: Please be seated, members of the
5 jury.
6 Now you are in a one-compact group. No one
7 sitting in the front here.
8 I am sorry for keeping you longer than ten
9 minutes. I am the decorating business these days. I have
10 to match up the wood with the carpeting. This took much
11 longer. It took five to ten minutes to select the wood
12 and the carpeting. They are building this huge courthouse
13 in Central Islip. That is on exit 43A of the Southern
14 State Parkway. I will have to take a helicopter to get
15 there from my house.
16 All right, Mr. Lee.
17 MR. LEE: Thank you, Judge.
18
19 CROSS-EXAMINATION
20 BY MR. LEE:
21 Q Good morning, Ms. Konopka-Choate.
22 A Good morning.
23 Q My name is Winston Lee. I represent Laura Weitz.
24 You know Laura Weitz from the time you were employed at
25 Who's Who Worldwide; is that correct?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Lee
1 A Yes.
2 Q And you had interactions with her; is that correct,
3 on the job?
4 A Not really on the job, no. Except an occasional
5 passing of hi or good-bye.
6 THE COURT: Passing of what?
7 THE WITNESS: Hello, good-bye.
8 THE COURT: Of hi, did you say?
9 THE WITNESS: Hi.
10 Q I would like you to first look at
11 Defendant's Exhibit Gordon-C. Do you have that before
12 you?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And I direct your attention to page 8 of that.
15 Do you see that?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And on that page it begins with the word "welcome";
18 is that correct?
19 A Yes.
20 Q And am I correct that that is a listing of new
21 members who have since the last edition of Tribute, who
22 have become members of Who's Who Worldwide; is that
23 correct?
24 A Yes.
25 Q And it is an attempt by the Who's Who organization to
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1277
Konopka-Choate-cross/Lee
1 announce and to present a cross section of new members who
2 have since joined the registry; is that correct?
3 A Yes.
4 Q And I would also like to direct your attention, if
5 you have it in front of you, Defendant's Exhibit Gordon-F;
6 do you have that?
7 A Yes.
8 Q I would ask you to look at page 42. That's a section
9 entitled Member Spotlights; is that correct?
10 A Yes.
11 Q And you spoke a little with Mr. Schoer on that when
12 he was asking you questions; is that correct?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And in deciding who would be included in, for
15 example, Member Spotlights, and let me back up a little
16 bit.
17 Member Spotlights is something that was featured
18 in each and every Tribute Magazine; is that correct?
19 A With the exception of the first.
20 Q With the exception of the first?
21 A Uh-huh.
22 Q And the other section I just asked you to look at,
23 the welcome section, it was a feature in every Tribute
24 Magazine; is that correct?
25 A Again, I think with the exception of the first.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Lee
1 Q With the exception of the first?
2 A Uh-huh.
3 Q Now, the sales staff, they did from time to time, it
4 was part of -- they endeavored to come to you as one of
5 the editors and recommend members that they thought were
6 deserving to be included in those sections, the Member
7 Spotlights, or the welcome section; is that correct?
8 A At times. But I think it generally came through
9 group leaders.
10 Q Yes.
11 And would it be fair to say that the sales staff,
12 Laura Weitz and others, would bring to the attention of
13 the group leaders their group leaders, and perhaps
14 directly to you, members that they knew of that they
15 thought were because of their area of expertise and their
16 prestige, they thought deserved to be included in these
17 sections; is that correct?
18 A Yes.
19 Q And in including these new members, that was
20 beneficial, of course, to the actual member who would then
21 gain the additional exposure and publicity by being
22 highlighted in these magazines; is that correct?
23 A Yes.
24 Q And it would also benefit all the members of Who's
25 Who, in that they would read about these new members, and
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Lee
1 learn about -- not only benefit from their expertise, but
2 learn about their new products and different ser
vices that
3 they were offering, correct?
4 A Yes.
5 Q And that was the idea behind it?
6 A Yes.
7 Q For example, I would ask you to look at, for example,
8 again, Defendant's Exhibit Gordon-F, at page 42. And just
9 the first member who is highlighted there, that's a person
10 by the name of Art, A R T, first name, last name Rothbaum,
11 R O T H B A U M. Do you see that?
12 A Uh-huh.
13 Q And in essence, it first describes him as the vice
14 president of Protex, P R O T E X, International
15 Corporation. Do you see that?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And in essence, it goes on to announce that he is --
18 he has developed two new products in the area of
19 shoplifting deterrence; is that correct?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And is it fair to say that not only did Mr. Rothbaum
22 derive a value, and tremendous amount of benefit by having
23 70,000 people read about the new products, but also people
24 interested in that line now found out about these new
25 products, retailers, etcetera; is that correct?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Lee
1 A It is possible, yes.
2 Q In fact, it goes further, to announce not only after
3 he announced the development of two now products, it spoke
4 of Mr. Rothbaum's next projects, his plans for future
5 security devices and what he had in the works in essence;
6 is that right?
7 A Yes.
8 Q And this is representative, is it not, of all the
9 Member Spotlights that were done on the various members?
10 A Yes.
11 Q If salespeople like Ms. Weitz, took it upon herself
12 to represent the new members, in effect they were helping
13 the new members deriving a greater benefit from their
14 membership, additional publicity, etcetera; is that
15 correct?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And Ms. Weitz, and the other salespeople, as far as
18 you know, am I correct, that they did not receive any
19 additional compensation or commissions for forwarding
20 these names to your department or to their group leaders;
21 is that correct?
22 A Not to my knowledge.
23 Q You have had an opportunity -- do you recall when
24 Ms. Weitz herself came with names of people?
25 A She probably would have gone to Debra Benjamin,
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Lee
1 because she was our boss.
2 Q Based on your reaction with Ms. Weitz, did she strike
3 you as someone who conducted herself in a professional and
4 a conscientious manner in the way she performed her work?
5 A I had limited interaction with Ms. Weitz and
6
everybody else, all the other salespeople, so --
7 Q Was there anything that Ms. Weitz or any of the sales
8 staff, did they do or say anything that indicated to you
9 her belief that she was defrauding people by selling them
10 a worthless membership?
11 A No.
12 Q To the contrary, everything you know of Ms. Weitz,
13 what she said and did, indicate her belief that she was
14 selling a legitimate and a valuable product to the
15 members; is that correct?
16 A Yes.
17 MR. LEE: I have no further questions.
18 MR. GEDULDIG: One or two, Judge.
19
20 CROSS EXAMINATION
21 BY MR. GEDULDIG:
22 Q Ma'am, I represent Annette Haley, you know her?
23 A Yes.
24 Q And you know her to be a salesperson at Who's Who
25 when you were working there also?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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Konopka-Choate-cross/Geduldig
1 A Yes.
2 Q You have talked both on direct and cross, I believe,
3 about this policy that restricted socializing between the
4 departments of the company at Who's Who; is that right?
5 A Yes.
6 Q Can you tell us what would happen if there was an
7 infraction of that rule?
8 A There is no stated rule. There were no stated
9 repercussions, but it was the general feeling that -- and
10 it was my feeling in particular as well -- that there
11 would be repercussions in Mr. Gordon singling you out,
12 perhaps not wanting you to work there. You never really
13 wanted to fall out of favor with him.
14 Q So, it was a rule that you made sure you followed?
15 A Yes.
16 Q And the repercussions in your mind were serious ones?
17 A Again, nothing was stated or written. It was just a
18 general feeling. It was difficult to work there at times
19 because of certain policies like that.
20 Q Now, you talked also in earlier testimony regarding a
21 trip to Vietnam and Hong Kong; do you recall that?
22 A Vietnam, yes.
23 Q Okay.
24 And I think you said that that was to be a
25 seminar; is that right?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1283
Konopka-Choate-cross/Geduldig
1 A I don't know what it was to be. It was before I
2 came. And my knowledge of that was to be the intention to
3 have the trip and there was not enough member
4 participation to have it.
5 Q Okay.
6 So the trip never actually took place?
7 A That's correct.
8 Q Did you ever see any memos or any kind of a writing
9 or notification to the various departments in the company
10 that the Vietnam trip had to be called off because of a
11 shortage of members?
12 A No.
13 Q And you were there when there was an effort made to
14 have a trip or seminar at Hilton Head; is that right?
15 A Yes.
16 Q And that trip also had to be cancelled because not
17 enough members signed on?
18 A That's correct.
19 Q And after that trip was called off, or after that
20 planned seminar was called off, do you recall receiving
21 any memo or written notification that the trip had to be
22 called off because not enough members had signed on to it?
23 A No, I didn't.
24 MR. GEDULDIG: Thank you.
25 I have no other questions, Judge.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1284
Konopka-Choate-cross/Geduldig
1
2 CROSS-EXAMINATION
3 BY MR. DUNN:
4 Q Good morning, Ms. Konopka.
5 A Hi.
6 Q My name is Thomas Dunn.
7 A Hi.
8 Q Was there any discussion or plans to -- for the
9 public relations department to attempt to get advertising
10 for the magazine from Fortune 500 companies?
11 A I think it was always intended, if we could, to get
12 advertisement from such companies that were Fortune 500
13 companies, yes.
14 Q At any time to your knowledge was there any
15 consideration to bring any salespeople into the public
16 relations department?
17 A I think there may have been some discussion about
18 that.
19 Q And do you know in particular what salesperson was
20 considered for that?
21 A It may have been Laura Weitz. I don't know beyond
22 that.
23 Q And was there, to your knowledge, was there any plan
24 to publish the magazine on a more frequent basis?
25 A We may have discussed it at times, yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1285
Konopka-Choate-cross/Dunn
1 Q So, it would be fair to say that there were
2 discussions about future areas that magazine -- the
3 magazine may go into, but because of the fact that the
4 company was shut down those things did not take place?
5 A That's correct.
6 Q Was there any time that a salesperson on their own
7 would walk in with any kind of written information on a
8 particular member that might be a potential candidate for
9 the magazine?
10 A Yes, there were occasions.
11 Q And do you have any recollection -- well, withdrawn.
12 Was there a particular salesperson or salespeople
13 who would actually walk into the sales department with
14 writing on potential members?
15 A A variety of them, I am sure.
16 Q Do you have any independent recollection as you sit
17 there today?
18 A No, I do not.
19 MR. DUNN: I don't have any further questions,
20 your Honor.
21 MR. NEVILLE: A couple, your Honor.
22
23
24
25
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1286
Konopka-Choate-cross/Neville
1 CROSS-EXAMINATION
2 BY MR. NEVILLE:
3 Q Hi. My name is Jim Neville. I represent Scott
4 Michaelson. Do you know Scott?
5 A Yes.
6 Q Do you remember Scott when you worked back at Who's
7 Who?
8 A Yes.
9 Q He was in the sales department?
10 A Yes.
11 Q And he worked at Lake Success where you did?
12 A Yes.
13 Q And it is a fact that you maybe would say hello to
14 him in the morning and then had nothing else to do with
15 him the entire workday; is that right?
16 A Yes.
17 Q That's another example or manifestation of how the
18 different departments at Who's Who were segregated, kept
19 apart, right?
20 A Yes.
21 Q Which would be similar to the flavor that you gave us
22 as far as not doing things that would go against what
23 Mr. Gordon said to do, right?
24 A Yes.
25 Q Do you know what Scott is charged with?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1287
Konopka-Choate-cross/Neville
1 A I do not.
2 Q Do you know he is charged with mail fraud?
3 A No, I do not.
4 Q Do you, in your working at Who's Who, do you remember
5 Scott having anything to do with sending things in the
6 mail?
7 A No, I do not.
8 Q Now, you heard about the civil case, didn't you,
9 where Marqui Who's Who, or Reed Elsevir, the company who
10 owns Marqui Who's Who sued Mr. Gordon's company?
11 A Yes.
12 Q For trademark infringement, things like that?
13 A Yes.
14 Q You knew that to be a lawsuit where Marqui Who's Who
15 owned by
Reed Elsevir felt threatened by the up and coming
16 Who's Who that you were working for, right?
17 MR. WHITE: Objection to the form of the
18 question.
19 MR. NEVILLE: I will withdraw the question.
20 Q Who's Who, where you worked, had a CD-ROM with the
21 listing of the members, right?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And it had the magazine that we heard a lot about,
24 right?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1288
Konopka-Choate-cross/Neville
1 Q Now, do you know that now Marqui Who's Who, following
2 the civil case, where your company was put out of
3 business, they now have a CD-ROM with the lists of
4 members' names?
5 A No, I am not aware.
6 Q Do you know that Marqui Who's Who now have membership
7 upgrades where you can pay more money and get more
8 benefits according to how much money you paid?
9 A No, I am not aware of that either.
10 Q Do you know that Marqui Who's Who uses mailing lists
11 to get names of people and uses those mailing lists to
12 solicit more business?
13 A I think that was discussed while I was there, yes.
14 Q And that is what happened at your company Who's Who;
15 is that right?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And Marqui Who's Who is doing it right now, isn't it?
18 A I don't know.
19 Q As far as you know?
20 A Yes, if you tell me that.
21 Q It is only if you know.
22 A I don't know.
23 Q Finally, the Marqui Who's Who -- withdrawn.
24 Did you know or did you hear that Marqui Who's
25 Who actually sent Mr. Gordon a letter telling him he was
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1289
Konopka-Choate-cross/Neville
1 nominated for inclusion in their Who's Who directory?
2 A
I remember something like that, yes.
3 MR. NEVILLE: Thank you. No further questions.
4
5 CROSS-EXAMINATION
6 BY MR. WALLENSTEIN:
7 Q Good morning.
8 A Good morning.
9 Q Did you have any interaction with Martin Reffsin
10 during the time you were employed at Who's Who?
11 A Only to see him in the hall.
12 Q Were you ever introduced to him?
13 A Possibly.
14 Q How often did you see him there?
15 A I couldn't say. Maybe once a month. I don't know.
16 Q All right.
17 Did you understand him to be the outside
18 accountant for Who's Who?
19 A Yes.
20 Q In terms of the administration department you spoke
21 about earlier, you indicated was Liz Sautter and Bruce
22 Gordon. What about Maria Gaspar, was she a part of that?
23 A At some point Maria came on. I don't know what her
24 function was, if she was an accountant also,
or accounts
25 payable or receivable, something like that.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1290
Konopka-Choate-cross/Wallenstein
1 Q Did you ever hear that Maria Gaspar was the
2 controller or chief financial officer for Who's Who?
3 A Yes. I think that's how we listed her in our
4 magazine.
5 Q And she was in fact a full-time employee of Who's
6 Who; is that correct?
7 A Yes.
8 Q As was Liz Sautter?
9 A Yes.
10 Q And Mr. Reffsin was not?
11 A I believe he was not, yes.
12 Q And you indicated earlier that Ms. Sautter was
13 Mr. Gordon's right-hand person; is that correct?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Do you know who was in charge of accounts payable and
16 finances similar to that?
17 A Somewhere between Maria and Liz, I would assume.
18 THE COURT: And whom?
19 THE WITNESS: Maria and Liz
.
20 Q By Maria, you mean Ms. Gaspar?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And by Liz, you mean Liz Sautter; is that right?
23 A Yes, Liz Sautter.
24 Q On the day of the raid, Ms. Sautter was there and not
25 arrested?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1291
Konopka-Choate-cross/Wallenstein
1 A Yes.
2 Q And Maria also?
3 A I don't recall if she was arrested, I believe she
4 worked --
5 Q She was not arrested?
6 A Not to my knowledge, no.
7 Q And Debra Benjamin was also part of the
8 administration; is that correct?
9 A No. Debra had a variety of functions. I don't know
10 that administration was part of them.
11 Q In any event, she was also not arrested; is that
12 right?
13 A That's correct.
14 Q Now, you indicated that Mr. Gordon was as what you
15 would describe as a hands on CEO; is that a fair
16 statement?
17 A Yes.
18 Q And basically anything done by any employee had to
19 ultimately have to be approved by Bruce Gordon; is that
20 correct?
21 A Yes.
22 Q Did you have authority to either spend money or incur
23 expense on behalf of the company?
24 A No.
25 Q If you needed to do that in the course of your duties
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1292
Konopka-Choate-cross/Wallenstein
1 with Tribute, what did you have to do?
2 A I don't know that I ever did. I think as I recall a
3 few times, I may have used my American Express and maybe
4 even paid back, refunded.
5 Q By whom?
6 A The company, Liz.
7 Q So, you would present the bills to Liz?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And at that time, at that point, if you had an
10 American Express bill, would you present it to her and
11 say, look, I used my American Express cards for Who's Who
12 business?
13 A Yes, I did that. But it was on a very limited
14 occasion.
15 Q If you needed to have the company obligated to
16 spending money for paper, advertising, whatever it might
17 be for Tribute, was that part of your function --
18 A No, it was not.
19 Q -- in the running of the magazine?
20 A No, it was not.
21 Q If there were expenses associated with it, other than
22 those you described as being associated with your own
23 American Express, who would you go to for approval?
24 A Debra, who would go to Bruce.
25 Q Debra would go to Bruce, and Bruce would approve it?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1293
Konopka-Choate-cross/Wallenstein
1 A Yes.
2 Q Do you know if Maria fit into that loop any place?
3 A She may have, yes.
4 Q What about Liz?
5 A I don't think so, no.
6 MR. WALLENSTEIN: Thank you. I have no further
7 questions.
8
9 REDIRECT EXAMINATION
10 BY MS. SCOTT:
11 Q Ms. Konopka-Choate, did you ever have anything to do
12 with selling membership to members?
13 A No, I did not.
14 Q Did you ever get involved in trying to persuade
15 anybody to buy a membership?
16 A No, I did not.
17 Q Were you aware that the company was regularly
18 obtaining names of prospective members from mailing lists?
19 MR. GEDULDIG: Objection to the question.
20 THE COURT: Overruled.
21 A Yes, I was.
22 Q How were you aware of that?
23 A Debra would order mailing lists that sometimes I
24 would follow up. I knew we were using them.
25 Q Did you ever accompany her on any trips associated
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1294
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 with these mailing lists?
2 A Not the mailing lists specifically, but I accompanied
3 her to mail houses, where the pieces were actually being
4 assembled.
5 Q Now, do you remember testifying that you didn't have
6 regular contacts with the sales force?
7 A Yes.
8 Q And approximately how often did you fraternize with
9 people on the sales force?
10 A You mean during business hours?
11 Q Yes, during business hours.
12 A If I saw them in the hall, if I was in the coffee
13 room, in the bathroom.
14 Q What about off hours when you were not at work?
15 A Usually once a week we would all go out for dinner or
16 out for drinks or something, a whole bunch of us.
17 Q Now, you remember testifying that Mr. Gordon forbade
18 you from testifying with people or fraternizing with other
19 employees of the company?
20 A Yes.
21 Q Do you remember if he said to you any reason as to
22 why that was?
23 A I don't think he gave a reason. I believe it was
24 just his edict and that was to be understood.
25 Q Where was your office in relation to the sales floor?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1295
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 A Well, for part of the time there were actually
2 salespeople in the section of our premises, where our
3 offices surrounding the sales floor. The latter part of
4 the time there were no salespeople at all in our office,
5 in that area, because our area was broken down.
6 Administration was in one corner. The main sales floor
7 was in another corner. There were some little offices
8 in-between where Maria and Gary were placed. Bruce's
9 office was over here. And our offices were in the
back
10 room. And they circled the -- they were on the periphery
11 of the sales room. There was actually a sales room. For
12 part of the time it was empty.
13 Q So, were your offices separated from the sales floor
14 while you were there?
15 A For part of the time, yes.
16 Q How much of the time were they separated?
17 A Half the time, three-quarters of a year maybe.
18 Q Were you ever able to overhear Mr. Gordon speaking to
19 the sales force?
20 A Sometimes, yes.
21 Q And on the occasions when you did overhear, what did
22 you overhear him saying to them?
23 A Nothing specific. He could be yelling at one person
24 or another, speaking loudly.
25 We didn't overhear meetings or things like that.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1296
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 Q Did you ever overhear Mr. Gordon
talking to the sales
2 force about bringing in money to the company?
3 A Yes.
4 Q What did you hear him say?
5 A I heard him say, make a lot of money. I am going
6 away this weekend.
7 Q Did you hear him say what that money was needed for?
8 A No. It was just a general, he was walking by, kind
9 of comment.
10 Q By the way, do you remember Mr. Schoer asking you
11 about who the head of the administrative department was?
12 A Yes.
13 Q Do you remember testifying that that person was Liz
14 Sautter?
15 A Yes.
16 Q And who was the head of the sales department?
17 A I would say Bruce Gordon.
18 Q Do you know who the supervisors were in the sales
19 department?
20 A Yes, the group leaders.
21 Q Can you remember from where you are sitting now who
22 those group leaders were?
23 MR. NELSON: Objection.
24 THE COURT: What grounds?
25 MR. NELSON: As to when, Judge. There was
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1297
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 testimony already that the group leaders changed at
2 different points in time.
3 THE COURT: Well, do you have a particular time,
4 or do you want to ask about any time?
5 MS. SCOTT: I can rephrase the question.
6 Q During the years that you were there, 1993 to 1995,
7 was there one person who was higher up in the sales
8 department than the others?
9 A Not to my knowledge, no.
10 Q Now, at the time you were working at Who's Who
11 Worldwide, who did you believe owned Who's Who Worldwide
12 and Sterling Who's Who?
13 A I believe Bruce Gordon owned it.
14 Q Why do you believe that?
15 A He would say things like this is my company. You
16 would have to do things the way I want you to do them.
17 So, it was my general assumption that he then owned the
18 company.
19 Q Do you remember Mr. Trabulus asking you about a
20 service that Who's Who offered its members called Med Jet?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And to your knowledge did members get that service
23 automatically for the cost of the membership or was there
24 an additional charge they had to pay for that?
25 A I think there was an additional charge.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1298
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 Q Do you remember Mr. Trabulus asking you about
2 discounts on services to members, like Airborne Express?
3 A Yes.
4 Q And do you remember you described those group
5 discounts for the jury?
6 A Yes.
7 Q Now, were these volume discounts?
8 A To my knowledge they were discounts based on our
9 buying power,
which would be a volume discount.
10 Q In other words, these discounts were available to
11 large groups of people who were interested in purchasing
12 the service?
13 A Yes.
14 Q To your knowledge, would such group discounts be
15 available to any professional organization with a large
16 group or --
17 A Probably, yes.
18 MR. JENKS: Objection.
19 THE COURT: What ground?
20 MR. JENKS: How would she know?
21 THE COURT: Would that come in your field of
22 knowledge?
23 THE WITNESS: It would have come within my
24 relationship with the people at Transnational, whom we
25 actually bought the services from.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1299
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 THE COURT: Overruled.
2 Q Now, turning to another aspect of your job, do you
3 remember testifying about press rel
eases?
4 A Yes.
5 Q Can you tell the jury what your responsibilities were
6 in connection with press releases?
7 A If there were press release services purchased or
8 otherwise, and you were given notification of that, we
9 would then call the person or persons, and write a press
10 release. It could be a general biography, a business
11 press release, or a whole package where there were actual
12 placements made in the person's local town, village
13 articles about their business or something.
14 Q You are saying members would contact the company and
15 say they wanted a press release written about them?
16 A I don't know how we got the information. It was
17 given to the -- through the salespeople to us.
18 Q The information that came to you, you would be asked
19 to write a press release for a member?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And is this a service offered as part of membership
22 or a separate additional charge?
23 A Both.
24 Q What do you mean when you say both?
25 A I think some memberships included the press release
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1300
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 services, higher-end membership, higher level, and others
2 wouldn't, and they would be purchased separately for a
3 small fee.
4 Q Did you ever learn about what salespeople were
5 telling customers about the availability of this service?
6 A I typed a pitch at one point for a group leader.
7 Q When you say a pitch, what do you mean?
8 A I guess a sales pitch. It was a script that
9 salespeople used, followed.
10 Q And what -- when you were typing the sales script,
11 did you have an opportunity to read it?
12 A Yes, I did.
13 Q What did it say about the availability of
the press
14 release serviced?
15 A It said it was provided. It was a provided service
16 or benefit.
17 Q And what, if anything, did you do upon seeing it with
18 the sales pitch?
19 A I discussed it with Debra Benjamin, because how I
20 viewed it, A, is that it was more work for us when we were
21 already overworked. And, B, it could possibly be
22 confusing to the members.
23 Q What about it could be confusing to the members?
24 A Well, provided sort of connotes that it is not a paid
25 service. And I think this particular case, this
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1301
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 particular maybe -- at this particular time we didn't
2 offer them as part of the high-end memberships, I believe
3 that came later.
4 Q In other words, it didn't state that an additional
5 charge would be paid?
6 A Right. It didn't state there would be an additional
7 charge. The that to me indicated the members would be
8 confused, and we possibly would have to write 250 press
9 releases in a week, which would be a lot or some number.
10 Q Now, did you ever discover that Bruce Gordon had
11 learned about your concern --
12 A Yes.
13 Q And how did you learn that?
14 A He yelled at me.
15 Q What did he say to you when he yelled at you?
16 A It wasn't my business. I shouldn't have been -- I
17 guess I shouldn't have typed the pitch letter, and -- you
18 know, he was just screaming.
19 Q What did he say was the reason you shouldn't have
20 typed the pitch letter?
21 A I don't think he gave a reason.
22 Q Now, do you remember Mr. Jenks asking you as to
23 whether you spent time at Sterling Who's Who?
24 A Yes.
25 Q Do you remember
testifying that you were there
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1302
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 periodically?
2 A Yes.
3 Q And when you went there, what was the address of the
4 location that you went to?
5 A 750 Lexington.
6 Q Did you ever go to the penthouse on those occasions
7 when you would visit Sterling?
8 A No. Not specifically. There was a time I visited
9 and went to the penthouse first, but it wasn't mutually
10 inclusive.
11 Q What did you do at the penthouse?
12 A The first party that Bruce had, prior to the two
13 cocktail parties.
14 Q This is the parties where you got sick; is that
15 correct?
16 A Yes, that's the party.
17 Q Do you remember Mr. Jenks asking you about when you
18 began working at Who's Who?
19 A Yes.
20 Q Do you remember testifying you began working there in
21 the fall of 1993?
22 A Yes.
23 Q Do you remember testifying that the first magazine
24 that you ever worked on was the second one that ever had
25 been published?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1303
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 A Yes.
2 Q Now, to your knowledge when was the first magazine
3 published?
4 A It actually was printed right as I came, right as I
5 started, November of 1993. And it was published
6 officially, probably, within four weeks later.
7 Q And before that time, to your knowledge were any
8 magazines published by Who's Who?
9 A No, not to my knowledge.
10 Q So, in the early part of 1993, were any such
11 magazines published?
12 A Not to my knowledge, no.
13 Q In 1992, were any such magazines published?
14 A No.
15 Q In the years 1989 to 1991, were any such magazines
16 published?
17 A Not to my knowledge.
18 Q Now, do you remember Mr. Schoer asking you about the
19 use of company cars?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And do you remember testifying that Debra Benjamin,
22 Liz Sautter and Bruce Gordon all had company cars?
23 A Yes.
24 Q Can you tell the jury what Debra Benjamin drove?
25 A She drove I think a Nissan 300 XZ or ZX. It was a
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1304
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 sports model.
2 Q Can you tell us what kind of car Liz Sautter drove?
3 A A Toyota Camry.
4 Q What kind of card did Bruce Gordon drive?
5 A I think at one point he had a Lexus, and at another
6 point he had a Mercedes.
7 Q Do you remember Mr. Jenks asking you if you felt
8 Who's Who and Sterling Who's Who were conducting business
9 in a legitimate manner?
10 A Yes.
11 Q Were there ever times you had doubts about the
12 legitimacy of the companies's businesses?
13 A I didn't have doubts about how business was conducted
14 in terms of what I knew. I probably had doubts over the
15 ethical issue after the litigation with Reed Elsevir.
16 Q Did anything else give you doubts?
17 A No.
18 Q Now, when you interviewed members for articles in the
19 magazine, did you ever tell them how their names were
20 selected?
21 A No, I didn't.
22 Q Did you have knowledge as to whether salespeople were
23 actually advising members of how they were selected for
24 membership?
25 A I didn't.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1305
Konopka-Choate-redirect/Scott
1 Q To your knowledge were members ever told that their
2 names were taken from mailing lists?
3 A I wouldn't know, and I didn't know.
4 Q Did anybody ever ask you to tell a member that they
5 had been taken from a mailing lists?
6 A No.
7 Q Did you ever tell any members that their names were
8 taken from mailing lists?
9 A No.
10 (Whereupon, at this time there was a pause in the
11 proceedings.)
12 Q Ms. Konopka-Choate, you mentioned some doubts you had
13 as a result of the Reed Elsevir litigation?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Can you tell us what those doubts were?
16 A I had doubts as to the morality of another Who's Who,
17 or a Who's Who that was not the Who's Who that everybody
18 thought of. And I had discussions with a good friend of
19 mine about that on a number of occasions. In fact, she
20 provided some --
21 MR. LEE: Objection.
22 THE COURT: Yes, discussions with friends what
23 whatever she provided, that is stricken, and the jury is
24 instructed to disregard it.
25 MS. SCOTT: I don't have any further questions.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1306
Konopka-Choate-recross/Trabulus
1 THE COURT: Anything else?
2 MR. TRABULUS: Yes. I have some, your Honor.
3
4 RECROSS-EXAMINATION
5 BY MR. TRABULUS:
6 Q Good afternoon again.
7 A Hi.
8 Q Hi.
9 I think you told Ms. Scott again that at some
10 point you had overheard Mr. Gordon telling the salespeople
11 to make a lot of money?
12 A Uh-huh.
13 Q Now, this was a business, was it not?
14 A Yes.
15 Q And it was being operated for a profit?
16 A Yes.
17 Q Indeed, the profits came through the sales?
18 A Yes.
19 Q Is that correct?
20 And one would only expect Mr. Gordon to ask his
21 salespeople to make
a lot of money, would you not?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And I think you indicated when you heard Mr. Gordon
24 speaking to the salespeople, you would hear him speaking
25 loudly?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
1307
Konopka-Choate-recross/Trabulus
1 A Yes.
2 Q And that would be because when he was not speaking
3 loudly, you would not be in a position to hear it; is that
4 fair to say?
5 A Some of the time that's true. When the salespeople
6 were in the same room as the editorial staff, then we
7 could obviously hear pretty much what he said.
8 Q You mentioned Mr. Gordon had a Lexus and a Mercedes
9 at different times?
10 A Yes.
11 Q And those were described to you by Ms. Scott as
12 company cars?
13 A Yes.
14 Q When you hear the term "company car" does that mean
15 to you that the company necessarily take as tax write off
16 because of the car?
17 A Possibly, yes.
18 Q Do you know whether or not the company took a tax
19 write off with regard to the LEXUS?
20 A I have no idea.
21 Q And with regard to the Mercedes?
22 A I also have no idea.
23 Q You indicated you had some concern that members might
24 feel that press releases were provided free of charge when
25 in many instances they were not; is that correct?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 A That's correct.
2 Q You never told a member that a press release would be
3 provided free of charge to that member when in fact it
4 would not be, right?
5 A No.
6 Q And as far as you know the company never told
7 somebody that a press release would be free to that person
8 when in fact it was not?
9 A As far as I know the company never did that.
10 Q You mentioned you were aware of the purchase of
11 mailing lists through Debra Benjamin?
12 A Yes.
13 Q Are you aware whether Debra Benjamin simply purchased
14 entire lists, or placed orders for very specific types of
15 orders from the mailing lists?
16 A Probably both.
17 Q In terms of placing specific orders, it would be for
18 people with a title such as president or vice president?
19 A That's correct.
20 Q Are you aware of any specific instance where that was
21 done?
22 A Not specific, no.
23 Q But you are aware that that type of thing was
24 generally done?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 Q In response to various questions put to you by
2 attorneys here, you indicated basically that ultimately
3 Mr. Gordon would have to approve everything that was done,
4 something to that effect?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And you felt he was in a position more than anybody
7 else to know what was going on or had to be done?
8 A Yes.
9 Q I believe you indicated there were about 100
10 employees employed at the Lake Success facilities; is that
11 correct?
12 A Yes.
13 Q And there were also the facilities in Manhattan, the
14 Sterling facilities, do you know how many people were
15 employed there?
16 A I would say probably 50 or 60.
17 Q And certainly, Mr. Gordon could not be looking over
18 everybody's shoulder at the same time; is that correct?
19 A That's correct.
20 Q And it is fair to say, that although he had a
21 responsibility and a desire to see to it that people
22 followed his directions, he was not himself in a position
23 to tell at all times as to whether or not they had? Is
24 that fair to say?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 Q Were you aware that before the raid, Mr. Gordon and
2 other people from Who's Who were invited to an award
3 ceremony that was to be held in Russia related to
4 networking?
5 A No.
6 Q I think you indicated that you had not received --
7 withdrawn.
8 Mr. Geduldig asked you whether or not you
9 received any memos indicating that the Vietnam trip or the
10 Hilton Head trip had been cancelled?
11 A That's correct.
12 Q Now, in your position, would you ordinarily receive
13 memos that were sent to the sales department?
14 MR. GEDULDIG: Objection to the form of the
15 question.
16 MR. TRABULUS: I will rephrase it.
17 Q In the ordinary course would memos sent to
18 salespeople be sent to you?
19 A No.
20 Q So, if memos to that effect were sent to the
21 salespeople, you would not be in a position ordinarily to
22 know as to whether or not they were sent; is that correct?
23 A Yes.
24 Q And you mentioned I believe after the fact that you
25 weren't working there at the time during the Vietnam
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 trip.
2 A That's right.
3 Q I think you said after the fact it didn't happen; is
4 that right?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And you understood that to mean that no members of
7 Who's Who actually went on the trip?
8 A That's correct.
9 Q Do you know whether or not there was a trip that
10 actually occurred that there was a trip that members could
11 have gone on, if in fact they had set -- signed up for it?
12 A I am not aware of the specifics.
13 Q You are not aware of the specifics?
14 A Right.
15 Q And with regard to the Hilton Head trip, do you know
16 if it was set up through a travel agency?
17 A I know an agency was used. I don't know if it was a
18 travel agency.
19 Q And are you aware that the members, those members who
20 wanted to book it would book it through the travel agency?
21 A I am not sure of the specifics. I didn't handle it.
22 Q After the raid, after Who's Who was shut down, did
23 you have any discussions with members concerning the
24 results of that?
25 A I had communication with members, although a lot of
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 members were not aware of what had happened. I don't know
2 if I ever spoke to them about what had happened.
3 Q Were there any members who expressed concern to you
4 as to whether or not Who's Who would be able to continue
5 to send them Tribute Magazine or provide benefits to them
6 in the future?
7 A Perhaps.
8 Q Now, several of the attorneys asked you questions
9 concerning whether or not you believed that things that
10 were in Tribute Magazine, various things, were true; and I
11 believe you indicated that you did.
12 A Yes.
13 Q And was it not the case as far as you know those
14 things were in fact true at the time?
15 A That's correct.
16 Q So, it wasn't just a matter of believing them, but
17 they were true?
18 A Yes, that's correct.
19 Q Now, you mentioned the administration department
20 which was headed by Liz Sautter?
21 A Uh-huh.
22 Q Do you know how many people worked in that department
23 under her?
24 A Ten or twelve or so.
25 Q Earlier you mentioned the mail was opened either by
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 Liz or Bruce?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Did you ever see those persons opening the mail?
4 A I may have seen Liz on a few occasions opening mail,
5 although not specifically my mail.
6 Q Is it fair to say that most of the time the mail came
7 in, you wouldn't have seen it actually opened?
8 A Right.
9 Q It wasn't part of your job?
10 A Right.
11 Q Do you know if it was Liz or Bruce or some of the
12 people who worked for Liz or Bruce or opened the mail?
13 A I believe it was Liz or Bruce who opened the mail.
14 Q You yourself did not see it?
15 A I saw Liz.
16 Q In general?
17 A In general, no.
18 Q Now, Tribute Magazine was not mailed directly from
19 Who's Who?
20 A No, it was not.
21 Q It was what is called drop-shipped?
22 A Yes.
23 Q Can you explain to the jury what that was.
24 A I think we had a bulk mailing or license or
25 permission, whatever you call it, the bulk mailing rate.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 The magazines were created in East Greenville,
2 Pennsylvania and shipped, I don't know where, but I guess
3 various post office facilities.
4 Q Were the directories also shipped by the people who
5 put them together?
6 A I have no idea.
7 Q Okay.
8 You mentioned that after the Reed litigation, you
9 had some concerns or doubts?
10 A Yes.
11 Q Did you have any concerns about Reed's practices or
12 businesses?
13 A No.
14 Q Were they explained to you?
15 A No, they were not.
16 Q And you concerned that they used mailing lists?
17 A I heard at sometime, yes.
18 Q And were you also told that they told prospective
19 members that they were nominated?
20 A No.
21 Q You weren't told that?
22 A No.
23 Q Did you actually see the letter sent to Mr. Gordon
24 nominating him?
25 A I may have. I don't recall.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 Q Do you recall that it said nominated?
2 A No, I don't recall.
3 Q Okay.
4 MR. TRABULUS: No further questions.
5 MR. JENKS: I have no further questions, your
6 Honor.
7 MR. SCHOER: I have a few questions.
8
9 RECROSS-EXAMINATION
10 BY MR. SCHOER:
11 Q You indicated there came a time you typed a
1
2 presentation and you became concerned about that?
13 A Yes.
14 Q Do you know if that presentation was ever used?
15 A I don't think it was used subsequent to my
16 complaining about it.
17 Q And Ms. Scott asked you whether anyone had instructed
18 you to ever tell a member that his or her name was taken
19 from a mailing list; do you remember her asking you that
20 question?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And did anyone tell you not to tell any member that
23 their name was taken from a mailing list?
24 A No, no.
25 Q You indicated that you had some doubts with respect
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 to using the phrase Who's Who.
2 A No, I didn't have doubts really to do that.
3 MR. LEE: Objection, your Honor.
4 THE COURT: Overruled.
5 A I had doubts relating to the company as a whole.
6 Q Well, did you know that Reed Elsevir did not have an
7 exclusive right to use the term "Who's Who?"
8 A Yes. I believe it was declared public domain.
9 Q It is public domain, right?
10 Are you aware of the fact that there are hundreds
11 of Who's Who publications?
12 A Yes.
13 MR. SCHOER: I have no further questions.
14 MR. NELSON: No questions.
15 THE COURT: Anyone else?
16 MR. LEE: I do, your Honor.
17
18 RECROSS-EXAMINATION
19 BY MR. LEE:
20 Q Ms. Konopka-Choate, as a result of the Reed Elsevir
21 litigation, did that in your mind, did that raise any
22 doubts as to the value of the Tribute Magazine?
23 A No.
24 Q Did that create any doubts as to the worth to the
25 members of having such a magazine offered to memberships?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 A No.
2 Q It didn't create doubts as to that; is that right?
3 A That is correct.
4 Q In fact, prior to learning that one company, Reed
5 Elsevir was suing Who's Who, you had no doubts based on
6 everything you saw occurring in the company, right?
7 A I am sorry, could you repeat the question?
8 Q Well, prior to the litigation -- prior to an
9 assertion by this company, Reed Elsevir in a civil action,
10 that Who's Who Worldwide was infringing on its trademark,
11 prior to that, did you on your own have any independent
12 doubts as to the legitimacy of what Who's Who was doing?
13 A No.
14 MR. LEE: I have no other questions.
15
16 RECROSS-EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. GEDULDIG:
18 Q You were asked some questions, ma'am, about the rule
19 of non-fraternization?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And you were also
asked some questions about the
22 number of people who worked in the company, and the rules
23 being set in the company.
24 A Right.
25 Q There were a number of rules that were in place other
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 than this one about different departments fraternizing
2 with one another; is that right?
3 A Probably, yes.
4 Q Were there rules that you were asked to comply with,
5 other than the rule not to fraternize with people in other
6 departments?
7 A You mean general office policies?
8 Q I am talking about rules that would have been set by
9 Mr. Gordon himself.
10 A I don't know. Could you give me a specific?
11 Q Did you ever hear Mr. Gordon say that he sets the
12 rules in the company?
13 A Yes.
14 Q And that you followed these rules?
15 A Yes.
16 Q Or you left?
17 A Yes.
18 Q And he was not talking about any one particular rule;
19 is that right?
20 A That is correct.
21 Q Now, when Mr. Gordon set these rules and told you or
22 other people in your presence to follow those rules, was
23 he a -- was he setting those rules in an intimidating
24 manner?
25 A Yes.
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 Q And did you have any doubts that if you violated any
2 rule set by Mr. Gordon you might lose your job?
3 A No doubts.
4 Q You could lose your job?
5 A Absolutely.
6 Q Is it fair to say that the people within the company
7 that you were in contact with, understood that?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And would it be fair to say that the people
10 generally, or almost always tried to comply with those
11 rules, because they knew if they violated any rules set by
12 Mr. Gordon they might lose their jobs?
13 A That's right.
14 Q So, there was an intimidating factor going through
15 the company?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And people tried to comply, although they knew there
18 were all these people working in the company, some 140 or
19 more people?
20 A Yes.
21 Q You say you overheard on occasion Mr. Gordon speaking
22 with the sales force; is that right?
23 A Yes.
24 Q But you did not hear any conversation at sales
25 meetings; is that correct?
HARRY RAPAPORT, CSR, CP, CM OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
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1 A Yes.
2 Q When you did overhear Mr. Gordon talking with the
3 sales force, was there any particular reason you could
4 hear those conversations?
5 A He was standing a few feet away from where my office
6 was.
7 Q Was he talking in a normal tone of voice?
8 A No. He never spoke in a normal voice.
9 Q What was the voice he would use?
10 A Loud, intimidating, threatening, not pleasant.
11 Q And that was a daily occurrence?
12 A Yes.
13 Q So, if you were a salesperson confronted by the
14 company's CEO telling you what to do, it was your
15 impression that those people did what they were told or
16 got fired?
17 A Yes.
18 Q Can you tell us how you learned about the Reed
19 Elsevir case?
20 A I think it was pretty generally discussed after the
21 fact, after the judgment had been awarded to Reed.
22 Q The money judgment?
23 A Yes.
24 Q That's the